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-   -   Waroo 13m or Era 12m....? (http://www.fksa.org/showthread.php?t=5149)

<jason 11-27-2007 06:53 AM

Waroo 13m or Era 12m....?
 
Hey guys..
Alright i will be able to swing one of these kites at the end of dec. They are within 100.00 of each other complete...i need the best lowend at 215lbs..are these to small...what do you guys think?
Btw i was at eb yesterday around 1:00 everyone looked awesome..!

SandiBottom 11-27-2007 07:03 AM

The new Best Waroo 08 is insane..so stable just a great kite.....you can't beat such a huge company to deal with..good warranty!!!!!

Unimog Bob 11-27-2007 07:07 AM

No doubt get the ERA 14. For as much light wind as we get around here you'll miss way too many days with the 13 or 12. The 14M ERA is faster than the 13M roo and pulls better than the 15M. If money is a huge factor you might still find a smoking deal on a 07 15M roo.

inferno 11-27-2007 07:46 AM

are you buying the kite as your biggest? or just your go to kite????

<jason 11-27-2007 08:43 AM

go to kite for sure...
Come tax season i may be able to pickup a used 07 bigger or smaller if needed...
But surely want my go to kite to be the best one...know what i mean...
Id sure love to get a quiver of new kites....but not going to happen.... Thanks for everyones help...

Tom Stock 11-27-2007 09:26 AM

Tough call... between the two I would guess the 13 08 waroo (NOT THE 07) would be better.

Mainly because Best has better service and if you don't like it you can return it (regardless of condition) no questions asked within 30 days.

At 215 you may need the extra meter anyway.

I've only ridden the 9m 08 (which I can ride in 20 at 190lbs), not the 13m so I am not sure of the high and low end of the 13.

inferno 11-27-2007 09:29 AM

for a goto kite take the 13 roo, i had the 07 and could ride it from 12knots to 25knots with two boards and im 205lbs (basically a 1 kite quiver for 85% of our wind), pre thanksgiving :)

<jason 11-27-2007 10:32 AM

good info ...
 
thanks for all the advice...really helpfull
i guess the roo is the kite...just have to get my wife to except it;-) ...she thinks the era is much better looking...:confused: oh well.. ;) thanks... _J-

Skyway Scott 11-27-2007 10:33 AM

I think these might be some guesses, as no one has demoed the 13m 08 Waroo yet (have you guys?).
The 9m Waroo is awesome, imo.
That doesn't guarantee the larger sizes will be good though.
It seems to me most companies struggle to nail their larger kites.

At your size, Jayson, I wouldn't consider the 12m Era, I would be thinking 14m. Unless you already have a larger kite you like and are going to keep.
Chris Bigger rode his most of the day yesterday (with exception of testing his 10m Era out for a half hour). It was gusting easily to the low 20's. It was a piece of cake for him to ride the 14. 25 is pushing it as his/my size though.
Myself and Bob ride the 14 in the low 20's as well. We weigh about 50 or more pounds less than you.

I think our winds fall into 3 main types of days -
We either have winds like yesterday (15 -22) or have sub 15, or have 25 to 35+. My point is, a 14m will work for a larger guy (yeah, you might be approaching top end at 25) for 2 out of the 3 types of winds we get here.
Then, if it's 25 plus, you would probably ride a 10m (maybe smaller.... ? ).
The 12m might be a 'tweener kite that you don't ride much, or more of a luxury for nailing those days that do stay right at 20 all day (never seen one ;) )

The 12m would leave you wishing you had a bigger kite a lot of the time, I think. Also, at 25 plus, it'd most likely be too much.
At my size, I have a 15m then drop all the way down to 9m.
The low ends on a lot of the newer kites are quite phenomenal.
My size doesn't hurt in being able to ride a 9m in 16 knots on my small board, either.
That's free advice, so take it as that. :) I could be totally off. I have just been watching Russky on his 15m Sonic ALL the friggin' time and it's left an impression on me.
The Era is cool looking. Especially BLACK... :)

toby wilson 11-27-2007 10:49 AM

I would also go with the bigger kite. I am 245 lbs and ride my 16M Thruster in almost EVERYTHING. Anything from 15 to 30 (no exaggeration, the guys out here can attest to that although not advisable as it was pushing the kites' limits). As Bayflite would say, all kites rock and though I do not have any direct experience on either kite, I am sure they are both great kites. I will, however suggest being a larger guy as well that you go with a bit of a larger size. I guess go with a 14M kite for your size is what I am trying to say. You can always then pick up a 10M or so for high winds and/or a 16M once you have the cash for extremely light wind. Bayflite can help with a good price on a Waroo, just PM him. Emerald Coast Kiteboarding or Ocean Extreme Kites can also help with either brand. I hope this helps... :)

Skyway Scott 11-27-2007 10:57 AM

Damn, Toby. You are lighter than me now?
WTF??!!:-P

Okay... back to my boring paper work..... this was a fun distraction.

WindRyder 11-27-2007 12:45 PM

The Era 12M turns quite a bit faster than the 13M Roo. I know it is slightly smaller than the Roo, but compared to last year's 13M, the 08 seems a little bit slower. Had the 12M Era and 13M Roo out Sunday and it was the turning speed that was the most noticeable difference. The 14M Nemi was very impressive in the lighter wind as well. Turns much faster than the new Roo.

SandiBottom 11-27-2007 12:46 PM

Had the 08 13m waroo out on beach sunday and also the new Nemi Hp 14 in the surf on offf shore conditions both worked great...really handled the offshore gust good in the surf. new 08 15 waroo just hit the shop also in Panama city at the Emerald coast kiteboarding shop...

toby wilson 11-27-2007 02:09 PM

Yeah, REAL funny Scott!!! LOL!!! I edited my post, 245, not 145 (I WISH)!!! LOL!!!

<jason 11-27-2007 02:15 PM

When u guys were flying the roo's and era's ...what were the conditions and how much do u weight...? Kinda thinkin id be better off gettin a 14/15.. I do prefer to ride Powered..tho still not sure..

shogun1204 11-27-2007 03:04 PM

Era and Roo
 
I am 6'2" 200 pd and I have flown both the 08 Waroo 13 and currently own the 12 Era. I can fly the 12 era on a 138 07 UG in about 14 knots all the way up to 30 knots easily. I would own the 14 meter Era for light wind but my 15 HT RRD still flys great and can't see replacing it any time soon. When I was flying the 13 Roo it was about 16 knots gusting to about 20. Very stable kite and very smooth. It unhooked very nice too! Just seemed slow to my 12 Era. Other than that I really like the Roo. I think the range of the 13 Roo is very similar to the 12 Era. But if you are down in the tampa area I would look at getting the 14 meter Era! I know Scott and Bob have flown that kite from 10 knots all the way up to 25 knots! The range on that kite is insane for a big kite. With that range you can get away owning the 14 Era and the 9 meter 08 Roo. (I have flown that kite too, and it's freaking sweet)

inferno 11-27-2007 03:11 PM

im looking at the 15m roo,
what setting did you fly the 13m roo on?
have you flown the 14m era, if so did the new 13 roo turn faster then the 14m era

thanx

Skyway Scott 11-27-2007 04:22 PM

I would be interested in the turning speed set on AA for the 13m as well.
The 11m Waroo on AA seemed too fast and jittery, at least for me.
I wouldn't even consider putting the 9m on AA :eek: (would you, Danny?)
You really can't go wrong with the 14m Era for low end, turning speed, pretty good top speed, unreal jumps!, and other stuff. It's a sweet kite.

SandiBottom 11-27-2007 06:55 PM

scott i do fly my Nemi 9 m on AA but I think i may be a little twitchy because i do drink a small amount of coffee now and then but it seemed to fly good..but I am sorta on the old side....

Skyway Scott 11-27-2007 07:02 PM

Wow. I wouldn't need coffee to wake me up on the 9 on AA. :p
I did an accidental kiteloop on the 9m in only about 16-18 knots trying a new unhooked trick and
thought I was gonna pass out. I landed right on my head full speed. Instant headache. :(
My point? It's fast enough to loop when you ain't even tryin'. :)

Tom Stock 11-27-2007 08:27 PM

Excluding the thruster (I haven't tried the new one), I would say that if you are considering a 14, then the 14 Era is hands down the best kite of those mentioned.

It's like a hypertype with a different bridle (so it won't overshoot your head). The kite is incredible... I jumps really really good, has a ton of power, and has really good low end. I don't own one but I've ridden one a few times and was really impressed every single time. I looped it and it was so quick it was back at 12 and pulling before I hit the water.

Every experienced rider I know who rode it really liked it a lot. I am about 90% positive it's going to replace my 16M 2006 waroo.

I'm 190 and rode it from 13 - 20 no problem.

Maybe Bob will let you take a spin on his if you by him a chicken sandwich on the way out to the skyway lol.

Unimog Bob 11-28-2007 05:16 AM

YOU are welcome to give my ERA a spin. I'm headin to the East coast today to move a boat to Freeport, I'll be back Sat. Order up some wind for the weekend, a strong SE would be nice.

Bob

PS I'm always hungry, a tender crisp chicken sandwich will get you an extended demo.

PPS The King kicks Wendy's ass when it come to chicken. Only a brand loyal fastfood pimp would say otherwise

toby wilson 11-28-2007 12:21 PM

Yo guys, I've got the hands down best chicken sandwich only available at Chick-Fil-A!!! You've GOTTA try it!!! ;)

Skyway Scott 11-28-2007 12:24 PM

I agree. Chik fil A is the best.
All other FFR (fast food restaurants) are OBSOLETE.
Wendy's can bite me, their fries suck :)

kite-4-life 11-30-2007 08:59 PM

Get the #1 on a wheat bun(30 cents xtra)- add a little Polynesian sauce and switch the fries for fruit or carrot salad.
For breakfast- Chicken breakfast burrito combo with OJ,fruit, and (good) salsa.
If the manager is working the window, throw them a compliment on their store/employees for a free chicken sandwich card- works every time!!!

BTW- demoing Freak Dogs sat. and sun. EARLY. at East Beach, check Sean's thread for kite info.

Airgasm 12-01-2007 11:26 AM

....at 170 lbs I can easily hold the 14 Era down in 25....and having a blast in 20...at your size I would guess you could safely add 5 knots to my speeds...which means pretty much a one-kite-quiver in the Era

Cheers,

Chris

WindRyder 12-01-2007 06:13 PM

I rode the 12M Era and 13M 08 Waroo today, back to back at St. George Island. I weigh 140 lbs and was riding my CF Pro Ltd 125x41 as the winds lightened up quite a bit:12-13mph. I was also using the 45cm Best bar with both kites. I would have to say that the Era has bit better low end than the Waroo, and the Era turns faster. I had the Waroo set in the AA position, and the kite felt very smooth, yet still sluggish. REMEMBER, the winds had died down, and I was only able to compare the kites' low end. Had it been blowing a knot or two more, the Waroo would have been more responsive and funner to fly. I have not ridden the 14M Era, but considering your weight and the experienced opinions of others who have ridden it, I would suggest the 14M Era. You will have the benefits of a faster turning kite, as I don't see how the 15M Waroo would be faster than the 14M Era based on today's comparison of the 12M and 13M kites, and just as much or more power than the Waroo 15. I am not knocking the 13M Waroo, but for me, I would have had more fun with it in higher winds, as the turning speed in the Era made up for it's smaller size with the apparent wind I could get with it.

bayflite 12-01-2007 06:35 PM

i'd like to re-try the era cuz honestly guys,
i didn't see the big deal.
all kites rock.
peace

Steve-O 12-01-2007 09:02 PM

Man you even got me even wanting to try the damn thing.

Wind rocks!!!!

Skyway Scott 12-02-2007 06:10 AM

I personally haven't found a better light wind kite for my likes.
But, I like being totally lit in 13 knots, having exceptional responsiveness, the turning speed of most 10m kites, phenomenal low end, all at a great price.
Being able to ride it up to almost 25 doesn't hurt either.

I have noticed that different people like different things from kites, so this kite is most likely not for everyone.

Some people like a lot of bar pressure so they can work out while riding, while some are mainly interested in water relaunch ability. :)
All kites rock for different reasons, is true.

Whitey 12-02-2007 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skyway Scott (Post 25800)
I personally haven't found a better light wind kite for my likes.
But, I like being totally lit in 13 knots, having exceptional responsiveness, the turning speed of most 10m kites, phenomenal low end, all at a great price.
Being able to ride it up to almost 25 doesn't hurt either.

I have noticed that different people like different things from kites, so this kite is most likely not for everyone.

Some people like a lot of bar pressure so they can work out while riding, while some are mainly interested in water relaunch ability. :)
All kites rock for different reasons, is true.


Please help me out. How can you be "totally lit in 13 knots" on a kite and then be "able to ride it to almost 25 knots". :confused:

When ever I'm totally lit on a kite and the wind doubles in speed which is at least 3 to four times (really more) the effective force / energy. I find myself in self preservation mode (along with everyone else on the beach who was "totally lit" before the wind doubled) trying to get the thing on the ground ASAP to get a much smaller kite.

I am sure you can ride it in 13kts and in 25kts. Just as I can on my waroo, ozone, and switchblade. But I would think the "totally lit" must be at the 25kt end of the window not the 13kt end of it.

Skyway Scott 12-02-2007 07:54 AM

Not sure about the physics. All I can say is today's kites are INSANE.
It blows my mind even, trust me.
Just ask anyone who watches me ride the kite if the statements are true, though.
Totally lit doesn't mean overpowered, not to me, anyway.
To me it means I have the power I need to have a blast.

I am totally powered up in 13 knots on my 130 Flexi, doing unhooked tricks on the 14m Era.
I can easily do 10 foot jumps at this wind speed.
At 25, the kite is too litt for unhooked, so I just go huge. Killing power is as easy as sheeting out a little. It's no big deal.

The sweet spot on the kite is right at 17 for me.
At that speed, I can unhook or go huge, it's nice to do one and then the other.

The secret is in the trimming of the kite and in being able to edge hard at it's top end, or edge just the right amount to haul ass in 13 knots and let the kite build apparent wind.
Lots of people (imo) kill their kite's ability to build apparent wind. I only weigh 165, that can't hurt.
I can feel the same way on my 9m Waroo from as little as 16 knots (on small board) up to 30 knots.
Again, I can't explain the physics and today's new kites blow my mind, compared to those of just 2 seasons ago.
I can say, in the light stuff, try to haul ass and build apparent wind.
In the strong stuff, I treat the kite more like a C-kite and try to kill it's power by edging hard upwind.

Plenty of people have witnessed this, so I will just wait for them to say "Yep, been there, seen it" :)
It's the low end that takes some practice "milking".
Trust me though, if it's blowing solid 13 knots, I will have a huge smile on my face (in flat water, non current situations).

The first time I handed Tom my 15m Hyper (in about 12 knots) he got blown off and had to come back.
I then handed it off to Donna, and she tore it up.
Maybe let's ask Tom how it's possible to be litt in that wind. LOL..

Skyway Scott 12-02-2007 08:21 AM

I should add, the fun at 13 knots wouldn't be possible without the board I have. The board is at least half of this equation.

Tom Stock 12-02-2007 08:22 AM

Simple... two words: apparent wind

In light wind you keep building apparent wind until you are hauling and effectively "lit".

In heavy wind (25) you don't let the apparent wind build as much since you are ALREADY lit.

The efficiency of modern kites lets them build a LOT of apparent wind. And this is what makes new kites have such a huge wind range.

This is why I can ride a 9m in 17 these days, but a few years ago I needed a solid 25-30 to ride my 9m C kite.

<jason 12-02-2007 09:58 AM

Thanks for everyones take on this...
It looks like the 14era is the best choice for my size.
Now ill have to see if i can swing the 13hundred dollars for this damn thing...i was thinkin 10 and change for the 13roo...or 11 and change for the 15roo...looks like ill have to knock off a few banks before christmas.....j/k...
-disclamer- if any banks get robbed in the tampa/st pete area i had nothing to do with it...
:)

inferno 12-02-2007 10:30 AM

i just got my 15 roo, havent had much time to get a good feel for it, but if you ever see me out there ill let you take her for a spin....

hopefully this weak front will give me the chance to go head to head with bobs 14m era....

bob you gonna dp on tues?????
or against scotts HT 15m.......

quick review.... it doesnt seem to turn as quick as the above but it has more of a grunty feel to it (but i havent tried it on its fastest setting yet)... and is probably the best bow kite ive unhooked on so far, no need to pull the depower at all, no backstall either.... landed an railey to blind on the second try and i havent even tried one in almost three months.... next time out ill start looping it and see how it does....

Skyway Scott 12-02-2007 11:19 AM

Thanks for all the inputs Danny.
Hoping to try that kite out. If we ride early, maybe we can switch back and forth. I think Bayflite might have one I can demo, as well.

Unhooking is easy peezy on the Era. It's a tad more technical on the Hyper (you actually have to depower the kite to the proper tuning point before un-hooking :rolleyes: ..... ;) )

Just, please, don't call the Waroo, Era or Hyper bow kites.
It makes me feel semi-queezy to think I am on a bow kite. :)


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