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  #41  
Old 02-20-2008, 08:59 AM
oldschool oldschool is offline
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Default Update Siesta Kook

1st off - that pic of the redneck was not too far off - I kid you not!

So yesterday, b4 the wind went sideshore at 2PM, I am taking a hour walk from Point Of Rocks (way south end of Siesta Key) to the Public Beach - just as I start to hit the guard shacks I see the same damn dark blue RRD crashing up and down - this time 100 yards from the water but the kite is crashing wear sun bathers are and within the posts marking the public beach

So of course I go over and here is hillbilly dude - he has his kite leash/bar tied off to the County's post that marks the N end of the public beach and he is walking from chair to chair suggesting, to everyone within a couple hundred feet of him, that they move as he is concerned he may hit them with his kite

Well, since tehe wind is NE that means he is flying and crashing his damn kite onto the public beach in and around the sun bathers

I go up to him - he says ... not you again! I explain this is ALSO not the place to fly - he tells me to get lost - I think ... damn - no knife again ...

So on my way back past the first guard station I stopped, identified myself as a local, law abiding and sane kiter, told the guards that we try our best to self-police but there is a kook up in the corner of the beach and even though I spoke to him he will not pack up

Guards were very cool and said no problem - I thanked them and said I was sorry for any hassle - one of them drove his ATV up to the corner and I watched the kook pack up and leave

BTW - if you are down at Siesta Key Beach you can't miss the guy - straw hillbilly hat and big scruffy mustache and beard - proof positive that stupid people should not breed

I am hoping his vacation in FL will soon be over

OS
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  #42  
Old 02-20-2008, 09:02 AM
Tom Stock
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Steve-O, thanks for that.

It's true, and it's a fact. The buoys are there to mark a boundary that powered water craft are not permitted to cross. This includes sailboats of any size, power boats, jet skis, and yes, kite boarders.
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  #43  
Old 02-20-2008, 09:05 AM
Tom Stock
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Good Job OS! That is exactly how it should be done in every case.

Blasting through the swim zones should be handled in exactly the same way.
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  #44  
Old 02-20-2008, 09:23 AM
Skyway Scott
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Nice OS, I think the best approach is beginning to become evident. Thanks for doing the right thing.

In terms of swim zones, I know that powered watercraft are not allowed in the swim zones. As of now, I am not for certain how we are classified.
Not too long ago I sat through a Captain's course at SeaSchool. I asked several of the law enforcement guys from Coasties to Marine Patrol to Sherriff's Deputies what the deal was with kiters. None of them knew for sure. I think we are just too new as of now to be discussed, at least where they work. As we become more prevalent out there though, and certainly if an issue arises, I have a feeling one of them will ask that very question of their boss. I think it's a real good chance that we will be classified as under (wind) power. I can't see us classified as a float toy.
My greatest concern is that they then treat us like boats/jetskis. Why spend a great deal of time and resources to write and enforce a new law for 100 guys (locally)? Why not just throw us in an existing group and treat us the same within that group?
From what I have seen and what these guys told me, one way to enforce the no swim zone for skis/boats is to not allow them in the zone - ever - as in they can't be on the beach.
The logic being a jetski or boat on the beach will, or has been, in the swim zone. That's why on weekends you see boats anchored just outside the buoys at the Undertow and you don't see jetskis on the beach, except at sites of rental. If they just treat us as a ski (with limited resources and time to invest drafting laws, I think that is a possible outcome) we could really be screwed, and fast. It may not sound "fair" and may not seem "right", but it's a possibility.

That's my concern for the beach, at the moment. It could easily affect a very large area of coastline overnight considering that we have marked swim zones for most of our beaches. Hey.... are we allowed to ride Clearwater beaches as of now? Why not?
Why is it so terribly difficult for some to extrapolate and see that this is possible along St. Pete Beach?
Knowing that making a small effort and staying outside the swim zones could terrificly lower our chances of having it happen here, but not having agreement on it, is starting to really eat at me, especially light of recent bans on the East coast.
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  #45  
Old 02-20-2008, 10:10 AM
Whitey Whitey is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve-O View Post
Check this out regarding swim zones.

One day at the Dunedin Causeway, southside of course, some of us were riding just off the sand. We were in the swim zone area. It was cold, no one was in the water. A cop drove up, and politely asked us to ride outside of the swimzones. We asked why no one had approached us before about this, and he wasn't sure, but again he didn't want us in the swimzones. He later came back and pulled up an ordinance on his computer. It was something to the effect of no powered watercraft inside the swimzones....it listed kayaks, windsurfers, jetskis, boats, ect. He explained that a raft was not considered powered, but anything with a powersource was considered a powered watercraft. Fine was $80+dollars. He was cool and asked us to spread the word and use the area just west of where we were.

The irony here was we could use the north side of the causeway no problemo....well that is where the powerlines are. Nuf said.

So I do not know if that ordinance stands for all swimzones, and like most it is up to the law enforcement to do just that enforce. It took years for someone to say something to us. Note here that on days the water is full of swimmers, riding was done outside the swimzones.
Just to be clear there are three types of markers out there. No wake, No combustion motorized vessels and Swim Zones.

The swim zone ordinance that the officer allowed me to read clearly states that no VESSELS are permitted between the beach and the swim zone markers. Then it goes on to define a vessel, and names anything and everything you can dream of that floats. Including surfboards, rafts, wakeboards, canoes, etc. Then at the end of the list it provides a very well written set of guide lines that allows them to include and deam anything that floats to be a water vessel (even a kids raft if they wanted to).

There is no room for personal interpretation here. It is a law, it has a designated fine attached to it.

STAY OUTSIDE OF MARKED SWIM ZONES where every you find them. And stay away from people outside of our sport even if they are not in a swim zone. For the good of the sport.

Go one step further. Make it obvious to onlookers that you are avoiding the markers. A life guard sitting in a chair watching us do our thing sees you tack away from a swim zone marker shows him you respect their turf, their job, and them as people. This quickly pulls us out of the outlaw rebel classification in thier mind, and they quit waiting for you to break a rule and just enjoy the beauty of the sport.

Most of us are guilty of violating these things in the past, that is history. If we all try to change for the better from this point forward and help remind each other when someone forgets we will all be better off from the change, and our sport will be better off.


Enjoy the power of the wind.
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  #46  
Old 02-20-2008, 11:04 AM
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amber amber is offline
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I'm sure that Al would be the best one to put something together regarding rules of the road on the water. I completed the captain's class/exam in order to teach on an oceanographic research vessel when i was working in the keys. We, as kiters would be considered powered under sail, so if we were face to face with a boat under power (even a sailboat with a motor running) we would have right of way. as for swim area guidelines, hopefully Al can help us get that situated. He is extremely respected in his field and has a lot of knowledge to share. Lets check in with him before we go any further with designating our own "rules". HOWEVER, i think that Tom's idea of 100 ft from shore unless landing or launching seems pretty reasonable in the interim.

However, i remember last year after the college tournament, there were spectators at the beach specifically there to watch the guys ride and those same spectators were aware of the possible implications of being this close to a rider. If someone chooses to sit in the water with a camera and allow guys to jump a foot over her head with a hard board and big kite, it really is her decision and there's only so much the riders can do. as for regular tour-ons (that's what we call the moron tourists in the keys), we must assume they are clueless and not get too close. just my two cents of course.
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  #47  
Old 02-20-2008, 02:25 PM
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Danimal8199 Danimal8199 is offline
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my .02, I understand what Steve S. is trying to do. I don't think that Steve thinks his 501c3 is the solution to everything.

I think that the kite-4-life org serves alot of other purposes and that we can achieve safety in other ways as well, however, this formalizes a kiting organization that has the potential to do alot of good and provides something more official.

Do we have a kiting steering committee? do we need one? No to the first, at least in a formal way, and maybe to the second.

I would say just use common sense, but sometime people lack that...

For now for everyone on here that wants to talk about being safe, including myself, should at least lead by example.

I was approached by Whitey or Steve-O last time i was at the dunedin causeway and they politely informed me of the launching rules for the west side. Its that easy, (not to mention i ride with these guys on a regular basis.)

Yeah you deal with a holes like OS did down south, but we are not kiteboarding robots so we should use the best judgement we can for now.

I hear alot of good ideas on here and there is alot of good self-regulation going on, so keep up the good work ladies and gents!
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  #48  
Old 02-20-2008, 03:18 PM
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kite-4-life kite-4-life is offline
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Right on Danimal!
I certainly dont think I have all the answers, they are just one route to take...I have done plenty of homework on this, and in my opinion, its the most sensible solution offered to address most of our problems. I would encourage anyone to put in their research and come up with better solutions, the fact is that most people don't want to do the difficult task of building something, especially for free. I happen to enjoy building things...

Last edited by kite-4-life; 02-21-2008 at 10:11 PM.
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  #49  
Old 02-20-2008, 07:46 PM
Whitey Whitey is offline
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We do not need anyone to interpet the simple task of DO NOT GO BETWEEN THE BEACH AND THE SWIM ZONE MARKERS!

The rules of right away are printed for right of way for different types of powered vessels approaching each other. I know what they are. The reality of the matter is that we as kiteboarders are by far the most manoverable of all vessels on the water and also stand the most to loose in the case of contact, which is when the rules are looked at. So don't even think about your rights just avoid being in the vacenity of any person, solid object, or other vessel. Doesn't do any good to say you were right from the dirt nap.

We are the only ones on the water that have the ability to move at 20 kts with full 360 degree visibility not blocked by our sails or rigging. We can turn on a dime with far greater manoverability than anything else on the water, and even if your a beginner you know that if you mess up you are only going one way --downwind--. Be aware of what is with in 500 yards of you at all times.

Make it a point to have a clear safe zone 400 yards down wind of you at all times anticipate and avoid any thing that can hurt you or sue you. If you ride by this simple rule no one will ever call you out for anything.

It's time to stop the talk, and as a group start from this point forward leading by example.

If all of us started today to make an effort from this point forward to create a buffer of 200 yards off of east beach that is only used to enter and exit the riding zone, making the riding zone everything that is 200 yards off the beach, stop lofting on the beach for fun or show, we would have nothing to talk about except what a great day it was and what new moves we did or saw on the water.

Trust me if we all did this as a group all at once, the few that choose not to or do not know better, will stand out big time and it will be very easy to deal with them. We don't need more rules, laws, line cutting, or to call police on each other, the beginners will adopt what they see being done by the people they aspire to ride like. The more accomplished you are as a rider the more you are being watched by others, and the more responsible you should act, it's just that simple.

If they see the best riders staying away from the beach unless going out or returning, turning off to allow someone to leave the beach, moving their kite up to the high postion when they are up wind of an approaching rider that is downwind of them, these things will be copied.

Just an OG's opnion. Enjoy the power of the wind.
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  #50  
Old 02-20-2008, 09:11 PM
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amber amber is offline
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whitey... no need to CAPITALIZE
"We do not need anyone to interpet the simple task of DO NOT GO BETWEEN THE BEACH AND THE SWIM ZONE MARKERS!" Its rude.

I was simply suggesting that alan give us some information because it appeared that some people were interested in learning the "rules of the road" for the water, and he is an expert. This thread is getting less and less productive. Yes, it is easier if the more respected riders in the area such as our instructors set a good example, which i believe they do. And for the record... telling people they can't ride within 200 yards off the shore at east beach isn't the biggest problem we've got right now nor the solution IMO. Here's my new two cents... shut up and ride.

Seriously... everyone commenting on this thread has good intentions for the sport or they wouldn't be wasting their time thinking about it. its the people that never read or listen to suggestions, posts, complaints, etc. that our "respected area riders" need to worry about in regards to protecting our access. People like bryan and steve-o are stepping up and dealing with the problem when it happens. People like Matt are ASKING to be approached if someone thinks there is an issue that needs to be addressed and he's more than willing to do that. These aren't the guys we should be complaining about. Its the ones that aren't willing to listen that we should be concerned about.

Somebody just needs to make a most wanted poster with the dude with the straw hat and his followers and go from there. nuff said.
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